Doubting Bro

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Posts by Doubting Bro

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  35

  Why do the local congregations always pay for the D.O. and C.O. visits?

  by RULES & REGULATIONS in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  every time a circuit and district overseer visited our congregation,the elders always wanted a show of hands from the congregation to see if we would pay for their car expenses and travel.sometimes the congregation would pay for airline tickets.it was always approved.. do you know if the idea came from the local congregations to pay?

  did the wts send out letters to each congregation to see if they would pay?

  we know that the wts always get what they want.. it's amazing how we paid $250-$400 for each overseer visit and the wts paid nothing..

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  Doubting Bro

  The official direction from the WTS is that if the COs expenses for the week are not requested by the congregation, then the CO can submit to the WTS for reimbursement. Technically, the PO asks the CO for his expenses (always submitted with receipts). The CO is not supposed to bring the subject up and is officially only to turn the receipts over if requested. I've been in congregations that had standing resolutions that gave the BOE the authority to approve CO expenses up to a certain amount ($125 for example). Anything above that would need a congregation vote. The circuit pays for the apartment expenses and those expenses are usually approved at the "business meeting" held each Circuit Assembly/Special Assembly Day. I believe the health insurance and cars come from a common fund administered by the branch.
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  10

  Independent thinking

  by under_believer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  those of us who are still attending meetings for one reason or another often hear the phrase "independent thinking" bandied about, from the platform, from the society's literature, and from comments from other witnesses.

  independent thinking, we're told, is a snare.

  it's dangerous.

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  Doubting Bro

  Awesome post. I think the answer is because while the movement started out saying religion was a snare & a racket, they over time turned into one. No matter how independent a movement becomes, once a bureaucracy is built, the emphasis moves from freedom of thought to self preservation. The power and control monster is given life. Independent thinking is the antidote to control and that's why anyone who wants to control another hates it so much.
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  46

  Told wife that I don't like going to the meeting

  by XBEHERE in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  finally said it out loud even though my actions have been showing it for quite some time.

  a fight ensued and now she isn't talking to me.

  the wierd thing is when i just didnt go she didn't say much (she hasn't been for over 2 mos for a medical reason) but god forbid i should actually vocalize that i don't want to go... i didn't want to give her any fuel to call me an apostate so i just blamed discouragement and my dislike of the elders which she already knows.

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  Doubting Bro

  There is some extremely good advice here. I am in a similar situation and recently resigned as an elder. As some of the others stated, I refused to do any more parts, go to any more elder meetings, and did let it "slip" to a few in the congregation that I had stepped aside because it was really obvious.

  Also, in regard to the wife, mine had the same reaction as X's. I really don't know which way to turn but I think all the advice is terrific. Going slow and allowing her to digest is a good plan.

  xbehere - you have a pm.
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  6

  Do Elders find the inactive and faders hard to deal with?

  by RULES & REGULATIONS in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've been inactive for 5 years now.i was taken off the ministry school, no hours in service, don't comment at the watchtower study and only attend 1 meeting per week.the elders try to see if i want to study with someone and i refuse.. have the elders marked me without telling me?

  do they want to bother with members like me?

  what is their next step?

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  Doubting Bro

  There is usually an effort around this time of year to touch base with the inactive ones and attempt to "reactivate". In my hall, there was a list that the secretary complied of all the folks that were inactive in the congregation. The WTS instructs BOEs to assign all persons with an inactive status to a bookstudy group. Usually, the book study "overseer" will be the one assigned to contact the inactive person. Since you've been inactive for about 5 years, they likely will offer you a study. If you say no thanks and keep it short, usually they won't push it.

  Usually inactive and faders are pretty easy to deal with from a BOE prospective. Out of sight, out of mind.

  Not saying this is a Christian thing to do (just the opposite actually) but I believe this to be the reality in many cases.

  R&R, you are probably off the radar until next year.
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  66

  Active JW's on this forum

  by winnie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  having read posts over the last few months, i have come to the conclusion that there must be alot of 'active' jw's who still regularly attend meetings/field service etc.. don't you feel that by posting your many and varied topics, usually complaining/disagreeing with the wbts, that you are being hypocritical?

  when you post your information, obtained sometimes in an questionable manner, doesn't it make you question your own underhanded actions?.

  you converse with many on this forum who are disfellowshipped/dissasociated, yet if you knew who these ones were, face to face, you would not give them the time of day!

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  Doubting Bro

  As with many that have posted, this board has been an amazing resource. I would venture to say that without it, I may still be dealing with the inner struggle over whether or not I have the Truth. Even apologists have doubts or they would likely not be in such a forum. Everyone moves at their own pace. Personally, I'm still in only for my family and have mentally checked out.

  As for treating df/da'ed, I never though that was very Christian. There were times when I was younger that I did shun, and I felt guilty about it. Its been several years since I've actually shunned anyone. I would use the excuse that I was an elder and was merely trying to "encourage" the person to come back. I also took full advantage of the "funeral " exemption which allows you to give comfort to the bereaved even if they are df'ed. At a funeral not too long ago where my JW family was present and one of the deceased person's relatives was df'ed, I made sure my whole family knew about this exception and they eagerly took my word for it and spoke to the df'ed person. I don't think the WTS has changed its stance on this, but it may have slipped by me.

  Anyway, I think we're all trying to cope the best we can and for some of us that are physically in but mentally out, this keeps us sane (sort of!)
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  49

  Do you recall your "point of no return"?

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  was there something special that happened, an event or maybe a deception, that triggered your point of no return as a jw.. .

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  Doubting Bro

  Mentally, I think the tipping point for me was my posting here. Once I allowed myself to see all the problems that I already knew existed with some of the theological problems (especially the 607 thing) in a big picture kind of way, I realized that the WTS is not God's organization. So, I started working on slowly divesting myselft.

  Physically, I'm still "active" but barely. If I can show my wife the truth, then physically I'll be gone as well.

  Isn't it unreal to go from gungho elder to unbeliver in just a few months? Just shows how fragile the whole belief system is. You pull out one or two cards and the whole thing comes crumbling down. Much different that what Jesus described as faith built on a rock mass. More like the faith that is built on sand.
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  34

  This Greber 'coverup' is disgusting, Isn't it?

  by AK - Jeff in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i had proven to myself, with help from ray franz and others, that the 'truth' was not the 'truth' about three years back - so in most cases i have paid little attention to further proof.

  once proven, always proven, right?.

  then this week, i began to do a little research into the greber thing - i typed in greber watchtower to my google seach.. 465 hits - and started to read a few of the websites.

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  Doubting Bro

  Interesting, I had no idea. Thanks for bringing this up. The more I find out, the less I know. Certainly an eye-opening experience.
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  20

  My wife says she's never read where JW's are to submit to FDS and GB

  by zack in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i have to give her credit that at least she is willing to discuss the misgivings i have with the wts.

  up to this point i have not.

  openly stated my disbelief in the jw theology and thinks some of my attitude is just the libertarian streak in me.

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  Doubting Bro

  Zack,

  I think that's a pretty common reaction. My wife said the exact same thing. She also said that 607/1914 isn't important and that the JW theology isn't based on chronology at all. That's because she knows she can't win a debate about the date Jerusalem was destroyed. I also got the, "your too smart for your own good" and "you think too deeply" remarks. She actually said we should just have faith, but when I said we critize others for saying that very same thing, she just gave up.

  I think what you're experiencing is the cult programming. Its pretty scary to see an otherwise bright intelligent person go into JW mode.
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  122

  new watchtower mag arrangement

  by shadowofbathory in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the latest from brooklyn ( my mate in upper management ) i thought id share.. .

  the watchtower is remaining bi monthly.

  instead of both monthly offerings sharing same formats there is a change coming into action soon.

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  Doubting Bro

  If this is true, which I have no reason to believe it is not, then I think it gives us insight as to the financial straits the WTS is in. I also agree that Awake will either be eliminated or the WT for the public will be merged with the Awake so that only 1 journal will be distributed each month.

  Not sure if they really think they can keep their wacked out ideas from apostates and the like since there are several people just here that would qualify to receive them and would be more than happy to share the crap spiritual feast.

  The internet distribution is a great idea to cut costs and would likely be welcomed by the r&f, at least in the West. It would cut their cuts even further.
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  108

  How Far Up The "Ranks" Did You Go In The Organization?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  at age 18, i was a regular pioneer.

  at 20, a ministerial servant.

  at 24 an elder.

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  Doubting Bro

  Welcome I'mfreenow! Quite a resume you have there! Look forward to hearing more of your story.

  For me:

  MS - 7 years

  Elder - 10 years

  Secretary - 4 years

  TMS - 2 years

  WT conductor - 1 year

  CA & DC parts

  Headed a DC department & CA department

  Aux pioneered more times than I care to admit.